- Question:
Is it wise to say that consciousness or atman manifests itself as non-living and living universe and it produces and experiences itself in it??
Sri Prabhuji:
An analogy can be given to the above question. You get a dream. In your dream, you become a king and rule kingdom. You fight with enemies as king and then you wake up. After waking up you realize that in dream everyone and everything is nothing but your consciousness only. You only appeared as king, kingdom, enemies… The dream is because of the power of consciousness called nidra shakti.
Similarly, Brahman (Atma), has a dream due to the power of consciousness called maya shakti. Entire universe, living and non living beings appear in the Universe. Brahman as Ishvara ( like a king in your dream) rules the universe. Everything in the universe – living and non living is nothing but Ishvara – nothing but the appearance of Brahman (atma).
Student: The “I” here is the pure self awareness which is consciousness…and the perceptions I experience i.e the objects, smell etc don’t really exist in the external world rather they are inside the consciousness…is this statement right to say?
Sri Prabhuji: In deep sleep the external world, mind, individual ego does not exist. Only awareness exists. Everything that we call as ‘external world’ is in dormant condition in deep sleep state consciousness.
Student: Right…now because advaita says that there is duality here, other people don’t exist in this dormant condition. But how does this work when a person is awake, and sees me sleeping in deep sleep
To me there is no world but for that person world exist
Sri Prabhuji: Let us take person A and person B. Person A is asleep for him there is no world. Person B sees person A sleeping in his world. Is that your question?
Student: Yes since both are same consciousness witnessing different reality?
Sri Prabhuji: Here we have to be clear about 2 entities. 1). Consciousness 2). Ego of person A, Ego of Person B. One who has merged with awareness in deep sleep is individual ego A. One who is awake is individual ego B. Ego B is seeing the world because ego has not merged with consciousness. Consciousness is the substratum. You can consider ego A and ego B as two waves rising and falling into ocean. Ocean is consciousness.
Student: When person A ego is merged with consciousness, theoretically that awareness will experience everything including person B right?
Sri Prabhuji: Awareness is everything. Ocean is all waves. When awareness is everything there is no question of experiencing anything other than itself. Seeing/experiencing requires individual ego. Each individual ego A or B are like waves in ocean. Ocean cannot see anything because the ocean is everything – infinite. Individual wave A or B can see other because they are finite
Student: Then the question is can we become aware of this vast awareness through meditation and samadhi state??
Sri Prabhuji: When we say “we” it is individual ego. Question is can wave become aware of the ocean – answer is “no”. Wave can merge with the ocean. Individual can merge with infinite. That is why it is said “Brahmavid Brahmaiva Bhavati.” – Knower of Brahman becomes Brahman only.
Student: But isn’t knowledge of the ocean exist and I am just a wave inside it enough?
Sri Prabhuji: Any knowledge is about an object. Atma/Brahman is never an object. Brahman cannot be objectified. Only way to know Brahman is to be Brahman. Mere knowledge is conceptual. Being Brahman is called realization.
Student: So If we can somehow transmit memory or information from person A, merge with consciousness and rise back in another form, we can theoretically wake up in another body, is this how Sri Shankaracharya did parakaya pravesha?
Sri Prabhuji: Parakaya pravesha can be explained in many ways. 1). If a individual A can access memory of individual B then he gets all experiences. This process is called mind reading. You might have seen magic shows – mind readers. 2). If individual lives his gross body as jiva and enters into another body then he can access memory of that person. Shri Shankaracharya took option 2.
2. Question
What is the relation between jiva and atman? Ideally jiva must also be part of atman right?
Sri Prabhuji
In your dream, you become a young boy and go to school. What is the relationship consciousness of a young boy and your consciousness? Your consciousness appeared as all objects in the dream including a young boy. Young boy is nothing but your consciousness appearing as a limited entity. Wave is nothing but the appearance of water. Similarly jiva is nothing but a limited form of appearance of Atma. However, atma is not limited to jiva. Atma is appearing as all that is there. Hence atma is not individual but individual jiva is atma. It is like saying all necklace is gold but gold is not necklace.
Jiva is not part of atma. Atma is infinite. Infinite cannot have parts. If infinite has parts, it becomes finite. Jiva is an appearance of Atma like a wave is an appearance of water
3. Question
I was thinking, is a bird dreaming that it is a bird, an ant is dreaming that it is an ant when we say the world is a dream?
Sri Prabhuji:
Bird and ant are dream characters. Consciousness is dreaming I am a bird/ant using its power of Maya
Student: So we have to say that consciousness is thinking of itself as a bird?
Sri Prabhuji: Not thinking, it is imagining.